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How do you voice extended chords?
Relationship between extended diatonic chords and modes?Max Size of a ChordWhat is a chord consisting of Root, 9th and 11th called?How are 13th chords with alterations “shorthand” written?Why does most “Country” Music use mostly major and minor plain simple chords?How do you figure out a chords name?How do I manage internalizing foundation for chords, scales, hamonies and voicingWhen a major 6th (or an octave thereof) is in a chord, when is the interval identified as a 6th vs. a 13th?Why is the first inversion of a C Major Chord very rarely used on guitar even though it is easier to play?Abstracting chords for a C++ classIdentifying chords with multiple extensions
If I have a Cmaj13 chord, it uses 7 notes. Basically all the notes of the scale. In a previous question, I was told that you rarely play all 7 notes for a 13th chord. So how do you know which ones to play, do you just randomly pick notes from it? Also if I choose certain notes it might just be a triad. So how do you get that defining voice that would make it a 13th, or 11th, etc when you just use a subset.
chord-theory harmony
add a comment |
If I have a Cmaj13 chord, it uses 7 notes. Basically all the notes of the scale. In a previous question, I was told that you rarely play all 7 notes for a 13th chord. So how do you know which ones to play, do you just randomly pick notes from it? Also if I choose certain notes it might just be a triad. So how do you get that defining voice that would make it a 13th, or 11th, etc when you just use a subset.
chord-theory harmony
Is Cmaj13 a common chord? I meet C13 (dominant) far more frequently.
– Tim
6 hours ago
@Tim just for the sake of example
– foreyez
6 hours ago
add a comment |
If I have a Cmaj13 chord, it uses 7 notes. Basically all the notes of the scale. In a previous question, I was told that you rarely play all 7 notes for a 13th chord. So how do you know which ones to play, do you just randomly pick notes from it? Also if I choose certain notes it might just be a triad. So how do you get that defining voice that would make it a 13th, or 11th, etc when you just use a subset.
chord-theory harmony
If I have a Cmaj13 chord, it uses 7 notes. Basically all the notes of the scale. In a previous question, I was told that you rarely play all 7 notes for a 13th chord. So how do you know which ones to play, do you just randomly pick notes from it? Also if I choose certain notes it might just be a triad. So how do you get that defining voice that would make it a 13th, or 11th, etc when you just use a subset.
chord-theory harmony
chord-theory harmony
edited 6 hours ago
foreyez
asked 6 hours ago
foreyezforeyez
4,95732480
4,95732480
Is Cmaj13 a common chord? I meet C13 (dominant) far more frequently.
– Tim
6 hours ago
@Tim just for the sake of example
– foreyez
6 hours ago
add a comment |
Is Cmaj13 a common chord? I meet C13 (dominant) far more frequently.
– Tim
6 hours ago
@Tim just for the sake of example
– foreyez
6 hours ago
Is Cmaj13 a common chord? I meet C13 (dominant) far more frequently.
– Tim
6 hours ago
Is Cmaj13 a common chord? I meet C13 (dominant) far more frequently.
– Tim
6 hours ago
@Tim just for the sake of example
– foreyez
6 hours ago
@Tim just for the sake of example
– foreyez
6 hours ago
add a comment |
5 Answers
5
active
oldest
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Conventionally, the most often skipped notes in any remotely extended chord are the 5th and any degrees above the 7th that aren't included in the chord name. For example, V13 chords in classical music almost never contain the 9th or the 11th.
One major exception to these conventions is the 11th chord, where the 11th and the 3rd often are assigned notes a semitone apart (e.g. for the G11 chord, the 11th is a C while the 3rd is a B). It is for this reason that the 3rd of an 11th chord is often skipped instead of the 5th.
add a comment |
Anything over a 7th must contain that 7th, be it major 7th or minor (b) seventh. It's been well established that the 5th (perfect) can be dispensed with, as its sound is contained in the root note.
For me, 9ths must have 1,3,7 and 9 - although if there's an instrument playing the root, such as a bass, it can be pared down to 3,7 and 9. Often in jazz, a four note chord - such as G7 - gets played with 3 and b7, just those two notes. Root probably provided by bass, and 5 not needed.
11ths are above 7, so need to have that. Often there's no need to play the 9th, and the 11th comes in rather like a 4th, so 1,3,(5),7,11.As 11 is the same note as 4, an octave higher, it doesn't sound good played as a 4.
On piano, it's very easy to voice any of these chords with or without the intervening intervals. Like the sound? keep it in. Dislike it? remove the offending note/s. On guitar, it's quite a different scenario, as often there are 5 or 6 notes to play, but fingering won't allow all. That's when it's more important to consider which get omitted.
13ths would contain pretty well everything, and the kitchen sink. The essentials for me are 7 (of course) usually b7, and 13, which is an octave copy of a 6th. So - 1,3,(5),7,13.
Obviously if the 5,9 or 11 is # or b, they need to be there, but otherwise, there's often little point in crowding things in.
add a comment |
If you look at the symbol Cmaj13 in sort of nicely reveals what is essential to voice this chord. You obviously need tonic for 'C', then to reflect 'maj' you need the notes that define 'maj' quality of the chord - and that's maj3 and maj7. Then you have '13' - the defining extension. All other notes are not neccessary to get a maj13 sound.
So to sum up, you need tonic for obvious context, you need to spell out the basic quality of the chord (maj, min, dominant, maj7) and you need the highest extension.
As for the rest of the notes there's no right or wrong - it all depends on the context, also it might be dictated by limitations of the instrument (eg. you sort of have to drop some notes to play Cmaj13 chord on 6 string guitar)
add a comment |
This answer is not entirely containing all cases but provides some examples and solutions:
As you may know extended chords are to find quite often in a fith fall sequence: You probably have noticed that here the 3 becomes the 7 in the next chord and the 7 can be the sustained 4 or falls a minor second to 3, while the tonic becomes the new 5: d,f,a,c => g,b,d,f => c,e,g,b => f,a,d,e etc.
The voicing rules in classic and in jazz and pop music are similar: keepin a note of a chord in the same voice by let drop the fifth or third to play the extended chord notes.
Notice that you have in this case the 5th fall in the bass line and two pairs of descending thirds guiding downsteps (in a progression of secondary 5th aswell in the diatonic 5th fall sequence and also with extended chords of 79.
add a comment |
Omit the 11th. Next one to go is usually the 5th. Then the 9th. C makes it a C chord. E makes it major. B makes it a maj7. A makes it a 13th.
In practice, the 13th may well be the melody note. Perhaps YOU don't have to play it. Likewise the root, if there's a bass player.
add a comment |
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5 Answers
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Conventionally, the most often skipped notes in any remotely extended chord are the 5th and any degrees above the 7th that aren't included in the chord name. For example, V13 chords in classical music almost never contain the 9th or the 11th.
One major exception to these conventions is the 11th chord, where the 11th and the 3rd often are assigned notes a semitone apart (e.g. for the G11 chord, the 11th is a C while the 3rd is a B). It is for this reason that the 3rd of an 11th chord is often skipped instead of the 5th.
add a comment |
Conventionally, the most often skipped notes in any remotely extended chord are the 5th and any degrees above the 7th that aren't included in the chord name. For example, V13 chords in classical music almost never contain the 9th or the 11th.
One major exception to these conventions is the 11th chord, where the 11th and the 3rd often are assigned notes a semitone apart (e.g. for the G11 chord, the 11th is a C while the 3rd is a B). It is for this reason that the 3rd of an 11th chord is often skipped instead of the 5th.
add a comment |
Conventionally, the most often skipped notes in any remotely extended chord are the 5th and any degrees above the 7th that aren't included in the chord name. For example, V13 chords in classical music almost never contain the 9th or the 11th.
One major exception to these conventions is the 11th chord, where the 11th and the 3rd often are assigned notes a semitone apart (e.g. for the G11 chord, the 11th is a C while the 3rd is a B). It is for this reason that the 3rd of an 11th chord is often skipped instead of the 5th.
Conventionally, the most often skipped notes in any remotely extended chord are the 5th and any degrees above the 7th that aren't included in the chord name. For example, V13 chords in classical music almost never contain the 9th or the 11th.
One major exception to these conventions is the 11th chord, where the 11th and the 3rd often are assigned notes a semitone apart (e.g. for the G11 chord, the 11th is a C while the 3rd is a B). It is for this reason that the 3rd of an 11th chord is often skipped instead of the 5th.
answered 6 hours ago
DekkadeciDekkadeci
5,20621320
5,20621320
add a comment |
add a comment |
Anything over a 7th must contain that 7th, be it major 7th or minor (b) seventh. It's been well established that the 5th (perfect) can be dispensed with, as its sound is contained in the root note.
For me, 9ths must have 1,3,7 and 9 - although if there's an instrument playing the root, such as a bass, it can be pared down to 3,7 and 9. Often in jazz, a four note chord - such as G7 - gets played with 3 and b7, just those two notes. Root probably provided by bass, and 5 not needed.
11ths are above 7, so need to have that. Often there's no need to play the 9th, and the 11th comes in rather like a 4th, so 1,3,(5),7,11.As 11 is the same note as 4, an octave higher, it doesn't sound good played as a 4.
On piano, it's very easy to voice any of these chords with or without the intervening intervals. Like the sound? keep it in. Dislike it? remove the offending note/s. On guitar, it's quite a different scenario, as often there are 5 or 6 notes to play, but fingering won't allow all. That's when it's more important to consider which get omitted.
13ths would contain pretty well everything, and the kitchen sink. The essentials for me are 7 (of course) usually b7, and 13, which is an octave copy of a 6th. So - 1,3,(5),7,13.
Obviously if the 5,9 or 11 is # or b, they need to be there, but otherwise, there's often little point in crowding things in.
add a comment |
Anything over a 7th must contain that 7th, be it major 7th or minor (b) seventh. It's been well established that the 5th (perfect) can be dispensed with, as its sound is contained in the root note.
For me, 9ths must have 1,3,7 and 9 - although if there's an instrument playing the root, such as a bass, it can be pared down to 3,7 and 9. Often in jazz, a four note chord - such as G7 - gets played with 3 and b7, just those two notes. Root probably provided by bass, and 5 not needed.
11ths are above 7, so need to have that. Often there's no need to play the 9th, and the 11th comes in rather like a 4th, so 1,3,(5),7,11.As 11 is the same note as 4, an octave higher, it doesn't sound good played as a 4.
On piano, it's very easy to voice any of these chords with or without the intervening intervals. Like the sound? keep it in. Dislike it? remove the offending note/s. On guitar, it's quite a different scenario, as often there are 5 or 6 notes to play, but fingering won't allow all. That's when it's more important to consider which get omitted.
13ths would contain pretty well everything, and the kitchen sink. The essentials for me are 7 (of course) usually b7, and 13, which is an octave copy of a 6th. So - 1,3,(5),7,13.
Obviously if the 5,9 or 11 is # or b, they need to be there, but otherwise, there's often little point in crowding things in.
add a comment |
Anything over a 7th must contain that 7th, be it major 7th or minor (b) seventh. It's been well established that the 5th (perfect) can be dispensed with, as its sound is contained in the root note.
For me, 9ths must have 1,3,7 and 9 - although if there's an instrument playing the root, such as a bass, it can be pared down to 3,7 and 9. Often in jazz, a four note chord - such as G7 - gets played with 3 and b7, just those two notes. Root probably provided by bass, and 5 not needed.
11ths are above 7, so need to have that. Often there's no need to play the 9th, and the 11th comes in rather like a 4th, so 1,3,(5),7,11.As 11 is the same note as 4, an octave higher, it doesn't sound good played as a 4.
On piano, it's very easy to voice any of these chords with or without the intervening intervals. Like the sound? keep it in. Dislike it? remove the offending note/s. On guitar, it's quite a different scenario, as often there are 5 or 6 notes to play, but fingering won't allow all. That's when it's more important to consider which get omitted.
13ths would contain pretty well everything, and the kitchen sink. The essentials for me are 7 (of course) usually b7, and 13, which is an octave copy of a 6th. So - 1,3,(5),7,13.
Obviously if the 5,9 or 11 is # or b, they need to be there, but otherwise, there's often little point in crowding things in.
Anything over a 7th must contain that 7th, be it major 7th or minor (b) seventh. It's been well established that the 5th (perfect) can be dispensed with, as its sound is contained in the root note.
For me, 9ths must have 1,3,7 and 9 - although if there's an instrument playing the root, such as a bass, it can be pared down to 3,7 and 9. Often in jazz, a four note chord - such as G7 - gets played with 3 and b7, just those two notes. Root probably provided by bass, and 5 not needed.
11ths are above 7, so need to have that. Often there's no need to play the 9th, and the 11th comes in rather like a 4th, so 1,3,(5),7,11.As 11 is the same note as 4, an octave higher, it doesn't sound good played as a 4.
On piano, it's very easy to voice any of these chords with or without the intervening intervals. Like the sound? keep it in. Dislike it? remove the offending note/s. On guitar, it's quite a different scenario, as often there are 5 or 6 notes to play, but fingering won't allow all. That's when it's more important to consider which get omitted.
13ths would contain pretty well everything, and the kitchen sink. The essentials for me are 7 (of course) usually b7, and 13, which is an octave copy of a 6th. So - 1,3,(5),7,13.
Obviously if the 5,9 or 11 is # or b, they need to be there, but otherwise, there's often little point in crowding things in.
edited 6 hours ago
answered 6 hours ago
TimTim
101k10104256
101k10104256
add a comment |
add a comment |
If you look at the symbol Cmaj13 in sort of nicely reveals what is essential to voice this chord. You obviously need tonic for 'C', then to reflect 'maj' you need the notes that define 'maj' quality of the chord - and that's maj3 and maj7. Then you have '13' - the defining extension. All other notes are not neccessary to get a maj13 sound.
So to sum up, you need tonic for obvious context, you need to spell out the basic quality of the chord (maj, min, dominant, maj7) and you need the highest extension.
As for the rest of the notes there's no right or wrong - it all depends on the context, also it might be dictated by limitations of the instrument (eg. you sort of have to drop some notes to play Cmaj13 chord on 6 string guitar)
add a comment |
If you look at the symbol Cmaj13 in sort of nicely reveals what is essential to voice this chord. You obviously need tonic for 'C', then to reflect 'maj' you need the notes that define 'maj' quality of the chord - and that's maj3 and maj7. Then you have '13' - the defining extension. All other notes are not neccessary to get a maj13 sound.
So to sum up, you need tonic for obvious context, you need to spell out the basic quality of the chord (maj, min, dominant, maj7) and you need the highest extension.
As for the rest of the notes there's no right or wrong - it all depends on the context, also it might be dictated by limitations of the instrument (eg. you sort of have to drop some notes to play Cmaj13 chord on 6 string guitar)
add a comment |
If you look at the symbol Cmaj13 in sort of nicely reveals what is essential to voice this chord. You obviously need tonic for 'C', then to reflect 'maj' you need the notes that define 'maj' quality of the chord - and that's maj3 and maj7. Then you have '13' - the defining extension. All other notes are not neccessary to get a maj13 sound.
So to sum up, you need tonic for obvious context, you need to spell out the basic quality of the chord (maj, min, dominant, maj7) and you need the highest extension.
As for the rest of the notes there's no right or wrong - it all depends on the context, also it might be dictated by limitations of the instrument (eg. you sort of have to drop some notes to play Cmaj13 chord on 6 string guitar)
If you look at the symbol Cmaj13 in sort of nicely reveals what is essential to voice this chord. You obviously need tonic for 'C', then to reflect 'maj' you need the notes that define 'maj' quality of the chord - and that's maj3 and maj7. Then you have '13' - the defining extension. All other notes are not neccessary to get a maj13 sound.
So to sum up, you need tonic for obvious context, you need to spell out the basic quality of the chord (maj, min, dominant, maj7) and you need the highest extension.
As for the rest of the notes there's no right or wrong - it all depends on the context, also it might be dictated by limitations of the instrument (eg. you sort of have to drop some notes to play Cmaj13 chord on 6 string guitar)
answered 3 hours ago
Jarek.DJarek.D
3546
3546
add a comment |
add a comment |
This answer is not entirely containing all cases but provides some examples and solutions:
As you may know extended chords are to find quite often in a fith fall sequence: You probably have noticed that here the 3 becomes the 7 in the next chord and the 7 can be the sustained 4 or falls a minor second to 3, while the tonic becomes the new 5: d,f,a,c => g,b,d,f => c,e,g,b => f,a,d,e etc.
The voicing rules in classic and in jazz and pop music are similar: keepin a note of a chord in the same voice by let drop the fifth or third to play the extended chord notes.
Notice that you have in this case the 5th fall in the bass line and two pairs of descending thirds guiding downsteps (in a progression of secondary 5th aswell in the diatonic 5th fall sequence and also with extended chords of 79.
add a comment |
This answer is not entirely containing all cases but provides some examples and solutions:
As you may know extended chords are to find quite often in a fith fall sequence: You probably have noticed that here the 3 becomes the 7 in the next chord and the 7 can be the sustained 4 or falls a minor second to 3, while the tonic becomes the new 5: d,f,a,c => g,b,d,f => c,e,g,b => f,a,d,e etc.
The voicing rules in classic and in jazz and pop music are similar: keepin a note of a chord in the same voice by let drop the fifth or third to play the extended chord notes.
Notice that you have in this case the 5th fall in the bass line and two pairs of descending thirds guiding downsteps (in a progression of secondary 5th aswell in the diatonic 5th fall sequence and also with extended chords of 79.
add a comment |
This answer is not entirely containing all cases but provides some examples and solutions:
As you may know extended chords are to find quite often in a fith fall sequence: You probably have noticed that here the 3 becomes the 7 in the next chord and the 7 can be the sustained 4 or falls a minor second to 3, while the tonic becomes the new 5: d,f,a,c => g,b,d,f => c,e,g,b => f,a,d,e etc.
The voicing rules in classic and in jazz and pop music are similar: keepin a note of a chord in the same voice by let drop the fifth or third to play the extended chord notes.
Notice that you have in this case the 5th fall in the bass line and two pairs of descending thirds guiding downsteps (in a progression of secondary 5th aswell in the diatonic 5th fall sequence and also with extended chords of 79.
This answer is not entirely containing all cases but provides some examples and solutions:
As you may know extended chords are to find quite often in a fith fall sequence: You probably have noticed that here the 3 becomes the 7 in the next chord and the 7 can be the sustained 4 or falls a minor second to 3, while the tonic becomes the new 5: d,f,a,c => g,b,d,f => c,e,g,b => f,a,d,e etc.
The voicing rules in classic and in jazz and pop music are similar: keepin a note of a chord in the same voice by let drop the fifth or third to play the extended chord notes.
Notice that you have in this case the 5th fall in the bass line and two pairs of descending thirds guiding downsteps (in a progression of secondary 5th aswell in the diatonic 5th fall sequence and also with extended chords of 79.
answered 4 hours ago
Albrecht HügliAlbrecht Hügli
2,468220
2,468220
add a comment |
add a comment |
Omit the 11th. Next one to go is usually the 5th. Then the 9th. C makes it a C chord. E makes it major. B makes it a maj7. A makes it a 13th.
In practice, the 13th may well be the melody note. Perhaps YOU don't have to play it. Likewise the root, if there's a bass player.
add a comment |
Omit the 11th. Next one to go is usually the 5th. Then the 9th. C makes it a C chord. E makes it major. B makes it a maj7. A makes it a 13th.
In practice, the 13th may well be the melody note. Perhaps YOU don't have to play it. Likewise the root, if there's a bass player.
add a comment |
Omit the 11th. Next one to go is usually the 5th. Then the 9th. C makes it a C chord. E makes it major. B makes it a maj7. A makes it a 13th.
In practice, the 13th may well be the melody note. Perhaps YOU don't have to play it. Likewise the root, if there's a bass player.
Omit the 11th. Next one to go is usually the 5th. Then the 9th. C makes it a C chord. E makes it major. B makes it a maj7. A makes it a 13th.
In practice, the 13th may well be the melody note. Perhaps YOU don't have to play it. Likewise the root, if there's a bass player.
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence PayneLaurence Payne
34.8k1666
34.8k1666
add a comment |
add a comment |
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Is Cmaj13 a common chord? I meet C13 (dominant) far more frequently.
– Tim
6 hours ago
@Tim just for the sake of example
– foreyez
6 hours ago